Dualism (Identity)

by David Turell @, Friday, March 13, 2015, 23:43 (3303 days ago) @ dhw


> dhw: I was answering your comment that “bacteria do not receive information”. Now what are you saying? That bacteria are not alive? Of course bacteria receive information. But our subject is consciousness, and I was helpfully trying to clarify your muddling use of the word!-I don't remember the context of your quote of mine. Same old idea: Bacteria are given and run on information so that they appear sentient ,but the responses are automatic.
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> dhw: I don't see how that [ quantum mechanics] leads to the conclusion that consciousness is independent of the neurons, and that the brain receives consciousness but does not produce it.-I'm proposing ,but have no idea if it is possible, that like a quantum computer the brain could be a quantum receiver for consciousness and receives quantum mechanism tools to make a consciousness appear from a basic brain neuron network. 
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> DAVID: I start with the belief that the inorganic universe cannot invent consciousness. It had to exist from the beginning as the universe was created.[/i]
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> dhw: I wouldn't presume that any such pattern will be discovered. Nor would I presume that the future will show us how divine consciousness has always existed (theism), or how life and consciousness evolved from inorganic materials (atheism). Both sides start with a belief, and proceed to draw logical conclusions from a premise that has no basis other than pure speculation.-And you sit on your fence, with no answer at all. I like answers. Maybe that is our difference.
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> dhw: It's a privilege, though, to throw ideas at one another, and I am grateful for all these exchanges.-Agreed absolutely.
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> dhw: May I then assume you believe that your consciousness emerges from the brain and eventually dies with the brain, unlike David's, which is a quantum pattern of energy that the brain receives from God and that goes back to God when we die?-You've got me correctly.


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