Brain expansion (Evolution)

by David Turell , Monday, June 08, 2020, 18:58 (1417 days ago) @ dhw

QUOTE: “[…] The mechanism, which has striking parallels with the more sophisticated brain neurons, could open up the development of living computers made of cells.

dhw: My proposal, then: As single intelligent cells joined together in intelligent cell communities, they produced ever more “sophisticated” forms of memory, object recognition etc., much as scientists today build on the discoveries of yesterday’s scientists.

DAVID: Membrane potential is a very potent characteristic of membranes and they changed it and it persisted to create the 'memory'. The article is lots of hype, nothing more. […] You have brought up the simplest of complexification and tried to equate that to working brain neurons and their complex networks and assigned regions of work.

dhw: You have merely explained how the researchers proved that bacteria have memory. The important thing is that they do have memory. And I am not EQUATING bacterial simplicity with human complexity, but am suggesting how the evolutionary process may have advanced from simple to complex. It was you who initiated this digression, but I’m pleased to see that you do not have any objections to my proposal.

The so-called memory is not brain-based memory, but electro-mechanical changes in a bacterial outer membrane. It is not a memory in the sense of our memories and these changes are common in the biochemistry of life. I view the article as pure hype, and in no way will it tell us how neurons work, as foolishly suggested in the write-up.

dhw: Now please tell us why a God who can organize autonomous complexification is incapable of organizing autonomous expansion.

Not answered.

Requires exact design planning of parts( regions and connecting tracts of the newly expanded brain. Complexification is a much more simple process of reorganization of what is currently present. What God has given all organisms is methods (epigenetic) for adaptations of existing physiology.

DAVID: Adaptation to high altitude involves increasing primarily the population of red blood cells by adding methylation to the genome as an epigenetic modification, an attribute we all have. God has provided this so He didn't dabble high altitude adaptations.

dhw: God has provided what? You have chosen this example, which according to you proves that the adaptations which were passed on from pre-sapiens to sapiens were not dabbled but were the product of an autonomous mechanism. If God created a mechanism for the autonomous production of different attributes, and you yourself have insisted that these attributes account for there being different species, then perhaps we have a blueprint for all speciation: cell communities respond to, adapt to, cope with, and perhaps even exploit different conditions and thus develop different attributes.

DAVID: Did you read what I wrote? All humans living at altitude can increase their red cell population. I assume the Denisovans genetically had a stronger mechanism, epigenetic change nothing more. Neanderthals with different immune experiences provide some protections for us though interbreeding. No special cell committees involved.

dhw: You wrote that as the many hominin/homo varieties interbred, "they provided/developed naturally different beneficial attributes to the final sapiens species." So I don't know why you then chose high altitude adaptation as your example. But the principle of the autonomous mechanism is clear. Now you've switched to Neanderthal immune "experiences". Dabbled or autonomous? What "attributes" were you referring to? And what is your objection to the bolded extrapolation from your comments - other than the fact that like your own theory, it is unproven?

All I have done is quote the current accepted literature about these interbred attributes. The Neanderthals gave us certain immune attributes. So? The Neanderthals had an immune mechanism, provided by God's design and different exposures than Sapiens, so the combination was helpful. I've discussed the magical immunity system and how it is designed to act over a lifetime to create a huge library of antibodies and other defenses as it meets different pathogens. Your comment in red bold is pure invention. God designed each attribute into humans. There never was a separate attribution design mechanism.