Free Will: Egnor shows neurological proof - PART ONE (Introduction)

by David Turell , Thursday, December 24, 2020, 21:57 (1221 days ago) @ dhw
edited by David Turell, Thursday, December 24, 2020, 22:02

dhw: And this is how you ignore what you have agreed to. The dualist’s soul uses the brain, whether sick or normal, to gather information – whether true or false - and then it does the analysing.

DAVID: No agreement.

dhw: You agreed four or five days that this was the case “in its limited form”, but never explained what you meant, and you bolded your own statement that “the soul is the analyzer, the brain its tool!” Why would these functions change if the brain is sick?

Because a sick brain will only give soul thinking with that ill brain a false analysis

dhw: Belief that the soul is responsible for thought does not “separate” it from the brain! But just like different parts of the brain, it has its own function – namely, to do the thinking.

DAVID: I will not accept this theory in bold. The soul can think only by forming thoughts actively using the brain's networks to create the thought. My living soul is myself, and I do this.

dhw: WHAT DOES THE THINKING SOUL USE THE BRAIN FOR, IN ADDITION TO INFORMATION GATHERING AND MATERIAL EXPRESSION?

DAVID: Form its thoughts by activating brain networks which it must use.

Activating brain networks to do what…to use for what?

To form its thoughts. The living soul without active brain networks cannot think.

dhw: And there you have the result of your refusal to consider what the soul uses the brain for. How can a dualist attribute judgement of right and wrong to the brain? That is the task of the thinking, analysing, decision-making, free-will soul! Once again, the psychopath provides an impeccable example to illustrate the case for materialism!

DAVID: Your total confusion is apparent. Do you form thoughts by activating you brains networks?

dhw: Yes – to gather information and to give material expression to the thoughts I have then formulated about that information! The materialist does the same, but he argues that the thinking part of the brain activates other parts of the brain.

The bold is the key!!! By what process does your self formulate thought?

DAVID: I remind you of my dualism approach: In life the soul formulates thoughts by activating and using the brain networks. Only in death the soul becomes able to formulated thoughts without a brain present.

You don’t need to remind me, and there is no disagreement – this is what dualists believe. But you wrote above that “the material brain cannot think without the soul using it to form thought.” In dualism, the material brain does not think!

Full agreement.

dhw: Our discussion started because you and Egnor try to make out that seizures are evidence against materialism. But the psychopath and the epileptic and the drug addict and the drunkard all demonstrate how thought is affected by changes to the brain, and your example of the psychopath’s diseased brain being unable to form a correct judgement is a vivid illustration of materialism and determinism, not of dualism and free will.

The bold is where your logic falls apart as you miss-analyze it. The psychopath is trapped at having to try to form thought forced to use a sick brain. The sick brain does not permit him the ability to form normal thought. Egnor and I believe we think using our brain. But a normal brain must be present to form normal thinking. A sick brain results in sick thought as the soul attempts to create it. The brain is just a tool for the soul, not an originator of any thought on its own. Pure dualism, no smidgen of materialism. What is your problem with this?