More Denton: Reply to David (Introduction)

by dhw, Sunday, August 02, 2015, 07:54 (3192 days ago) @ David Turell
edited by dhw, Sunday, August 02, 2015, 09:20

dhw: You can ask the same question about your undiscovered 3.8-billion-year computer programme containing all the innovations from bacteria to human. Where is it hiding?
DAVID: As you just stated, in the genome DNA.
dhw: I didn't state the location - you did, and I simply repeated your phrasing in order to distinguish between the two hypothetical driving forces. I have always stated that the inventive mechanism must have been present in the first cells, which is as far as I can go, but I'm quite happy to change that to the first DNA if it makes you happy!
DAVID: The point to be emphasized is that DNA is the code of life. Since we know of no other code, just modifying mechanisms to the expression of genes in DNA, any complexity causing mechanism or inventive mechanism must reside there. -That's fine with me. The point to be emphasized is that you have at long last agreed to the possibility that evolution might be driven by an autonomous, intelligent, inventive mechanism within the cell. Whereabouts it is situated in the cell is a different issue.-dhw: You described God's guided evolution as a simple process, and I showed you just how complex it would have had to be. I don't need to repeat it all, do I?-DAVID: For humans the planning would appear to be very complex, but in my view not for God.-Sorry, but when you described God's guided evolution (i.e. a colossal set of computer programmes passed down from the first cells through billions of years to billions of organisms to switch on as and when the time was right, catering for all environments - or alternatively God personally fiddling around with the insides of billions of organisms) as a “simple process”, I thought you were speaking for David Turell and not for God.-dhw: As you stated above, through an “onboard mechanism for planning”, which is the exact opposite of an onboard mechanism for automatically carrying out plans already made 3 billion years earlier. (The location of the mechanism is a separate issue.)
DAVID: I've always said I don't know if plans for complexity are 3.8 billion years old or devolve from guidelines as issues appear. but I'm convinced the mechanism has to be in DNA.-“Devolve from guidelines as issues appear” (what you used to call God's dabbling) is very different from the “onboard mechanism for planning” you agreed to on Wednesday July 29 as an alternative to your 3.8 billion-year-old programme. I hope these obfuscations are not an attempt to backtrack on our historic agreement.