Miscellany (General)

by David Turell , Wednesday, September 01, 2021, 20:40 (969 days ago) @ dhw

Part One

Antibodies

DAVID: You always twist my statements. You know full well I believe God gave cells the instructions of how to take action.

dhw: I am not twisting your statement above. I am pointing out that it is a complete reversal of your statement four weeks ago, as follows:

dhw: “Do you mean that your God planted instructions on how to create each new antibody for each new future threat? Or do you mean that he [God] gave our cells the ABILITY to recognize each new threat and to respond to it by creating new antibodies de novo without him having to intervene”?

DAVID: You’ve got it!!! The latter portion of your comment is exactly what God did!

dhw: Not the first option, which was following instructions, but the second option, which was an autonomous ability. As I mentioned earlier, this form of "volte face" has become a regular feature of our discussions, as in the threads on time and evolution.

You know full well my constant position is cells follow God's instructions to do their work. The 'ability' you cited and I praised includes the understanding of the instructions. Cells don't think. And with the instructions to be followed God does not have to intervene any further.

Rethinking brain organization
DAVID: Cleared up above: "DAVID: So I'll change it to they [the cells] act as if autonomous."

dhw: Why do you refuse to contemplate the POSSIBILITY that they ARE autonomous, as you agreed, so emphatically four weeks ago?

DAVID: Do you deliberately misinterpret my positions? Cells run on God's designed instructions.

dhw: I know that is your position, despite your statement to the contrary four weeks ago. And I have just asked why you refuse to contemplate the POSSIBILITY that you were right four weeks ago.

I did not concede the point four weeks ago. God gave the 'ability' with His instructions, and therefore did not have to intervene further. A perfect interpretation of your statement.

New amphibious whale

DAVID: What I agree to in the past involved your general view of evolution from the standpoint of a very humanized God who had no clear view of any specific goal and preferred free-for-alls and experimenting, nothing more.

dhw: You often accuse me of twisting your statements. I have repeatedly told you that in all my alternative theistic theories, my God has a specific goal: the free-for-all is to create an unpredictable and ever changing world which he can watch with interest; experimenting allows for your own goal of producing a life form that will in some ways “mimic” him.

No change from your very humanized form of a God.

DAVID: Not logical with my view of God. As for brilliant cells doing required design, it is a fantastic extrapolation of cells/bacterial known abilities to make small required adjustments, but always remaining the same species, as in Lenski's E. coli.

dhw: And I would suggest that if your God exists, he is perfectly capable of giving cells the autonomous ability to change their own structures in order to adapt to or exploit new conditions. This is no less “fantastic” than your 3.8-billion-year-old computer programme for every single evolutionary change, or the theory that your God pops in to perform all the necessary operations for every single evolutionary change, and to issue instructions for every single problem.

Your theory of God-given cell intelligence involves much more complex design than straight design by the designer himself, especially if a desired endpoint (humans) is present. But I know you have no idea why we are here. You just accept it without reason.