Return to David's theory of evolution (Evolution)

by dhw, Saturday, October 29, 2022, 08:56 (551 days ago) @ David Turell

dhw: […] The question you can’t answer here is why for 3.X billion years he designed giant bushes of life, the vast majority of whose branches had no connection with what you say was his one and only purpose.

DAVID: No one knows God's exact reasoning, but what happened makes good sense to me. You must first make the assumption God chose to evolve us which fit the history.

If your God exists, your assumption is that he chose to evolve (by which you actually mean design) every single life form that ever existed, not to mention every ecosystem, lifestyle, strategy and natural wonder!

DAVID: We are the surprising result, if natural evolution is accepted. That is Adler's point: our amazing brain with its fully capable consciousness had to be a result of direct God activity, not nature.

The whole design argument is based on the principle that ALL life forms are too complex to have been the result of what you call “natural” evolution. Are you now telling us that, for instance, the brontosaurus was NOT a surprising result if “natural” evolution was accepted? But you are yet again deliberately pretending that the issue here is the existence of your God as designer in order to dodge the bolded question at the start of this post, which you can’t answer. This dodging game is getting tiresome!

DAVID: The giant bush was created for a purpose: our food. All very logical.
And later: .
DAVID: Today's bush provides our food.

I doubt if anyone would disagree with your observation that today's food supply supplies us with food. You are on safe ground. Now please explain why your God would have designed all the dead ends of past giant food bushes which had no connection with us and our food, although you insist that they were all “absolute requirements” in preparation for us and our food.

The Cambrian Explosion

DAVID: Starting many new phyla which ended at 37, provided the necessary bush of life, which formed the overall ecosystems that provide our current food supply needs. What God did makes perfect sense to me.

dhw: Now you are telling us that 500+ million years ago your God created not only the human line of life, but also those of our foods, without any predecessors. So all the life forms etc that he designed before the Cambrian had no connection with us or with our food supplies! They were all dead ends. Once more, why would your God, who can do what he likes, have designed all those dead ends?

DAVID: Previously explained: the substrate of evolutionary advances involves advancing biochemical complexity in living forms and environmental changes offering a better environment (for the Cambrian more oxygen) for more complex forms. Evolution is the present built from the past.

dhw: All very true, but this does not explain why an all-powerful God who knows what he wants (us plus food), and knows how to get it, decided first to specially design environments and organisms which had no connection with the only forms and environments he wanted to design. He might just as well have started life in the Cambrian, since you insist that he designed our whole bush of life forms without any predecessors. […]

DAVID: Same old problem. Allow God to choose His methodology. He doesn't think as you do, telling us how He could do it better. Stick with real history and result in real answers.

It is not “real history” that your God exists, that if he does, his sole purpose from the beginning was to design us and our food, or that he designed the countless forms of life and food which had no connection with us. Your personal opinions then become totally illogical if you also believe that after 3.x billion years, he started all over again with a collection of brand new life forms and foods without predecessors, some of which (but not all) eventually led to us. Why would your all-powerful God have created all those dead ends if he was planning to start afresh in the Cambrian? You can find no explanation, but you go on pretending that you know your God’s thoughts! By contrast, you have accepted that all my alternatives do fit in with “real history”, but they do not agree with your personal interpretation of your God’s thoughts.

Food need (transferred from “More miscellany”):

QUOTE: This technology can improve plant production speed and has the potential to help address global food supply issues.

DAVID: Then you do understand the vital balance between our burgeoning population and food.

dhw: I have never questioned it. ALL life forms need food and ALL ecosystems have always needed “balance” in order for them to get it! But this article has nothing to do with your illogical theories of evolution. The subject here is a new farming technique!

DAVID: Which provides a better necessary food supply!!

That remains to be seen. Meanwhile, please stop trying to equate our obvious need for food with the issue of why your God would act in ways which you impose on him and which you yourself cannot understand.